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Gun control - the NZ experience
#1
If you recall, we had a nasty terrorist attack a year or so back killing 51 people in a mosque. The perp was a foreigner who had been given a gun licence without due investigation by the cops.

The left wing government used the opportunity to grab all the semi auto rifles.

So what's the result?

NZ GUN CRIME RATES SOAR FOLLOWING GUN BANS

American gun control activists looked at New Zealand’s response to the Christchurch massacre with a high degree of awe. They desperately want the United States to follow that lead after the next mass shooting. They would love for our government to swoop in after such an event and snatch away all our guns, but particularly those nasty so-called “assault weapons” that they don’t think we have any business owning.
They applauded Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern for her quick response, but what really happened was more of a knee-jerk reaction. She responded with liberal reflexes rather than taking the time to look at the situation rationally, and she’s been applauded by gun grabbers for it.
However, one thing we on the pro-gun side said would happen in response seems to have come to pass.


Quote:New figures obtained by RNZ show last year had the highest rates of gun crime and deaths involving firearms for nearly 10 years.
But despite that rise, there has not been a corresponding increase in officers taking out or using their guns.
The figures, obtained from police under the Official Information Act, show the rates of gun crime went up in both 2018 and 2019.
Last year, there were 3540 occasions where an offender was found with a gun.
And in both of the last two years, the rate of deadly incidents involving a firearm was the highest it had been since 2009.
The number of guns seized by police is also on the rise, up almost 50 percent on five years earlier at 1263 last year.
 
You mean banning guns doesn’t actually reduce gun crime?
I’m shocked.
I’m completely and totally shocked.
No, really.
What’s shocking, though, isn’t that this happened. It’s that this happened yet again and anti-gunners are still able to delude themselves into believing that gun control reduces gun crime. It doesn’t. While some of our gun controlled states have low crime, it has a low crime in spite of those laws, not because of them.
It seems like a universal truth that in the immediate aftermath of enacting tough gun control laws, gun crime goes up. That doesn’t make a lot of sense unless you realize that the very people not complying with the law include a large number of criminals who aren’t going to comply with any law. Now, though, they know that their potential targets are less likely to be able to defend themselves. For them, it’s time to step up and get busy because no one can stop them.
Note how the police aren’t using their guns any more than normal? That’s not surprising. After all, the police show up just in time to draw a chalk outline around the body. They don’t prevent crimes so much as respond to them and the criminals know this. They do what they’re going to do and leave before the police show up.
In fact, expect to see still more increases in so-called “gun crime” in New Zealand, at least until some degree of sanity returns and the government there goes back to respecting the right of the people to keep and bear arms. It’s only too bad that we’re pretty much the only nation with that right preserved in our Constitution. New Zealanders could probably use that right about now.
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#2
Sad Sad  Sooooooo.......nobody in NZ is safe unless they carry around one of those semi-automatics ? ? ?



[Image: c32ae080-1daf-4636-b4e5-f7d8a19e19ea-060...=srgb&q=70]
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#3
No. That's not the case.

The points are:

> That gangsters will get guns regardless of any law and shoot people, while the average legal gun owner will not

> It doesn't require an AR to cause mayhem - some of your worst shootings were committed with pistols and they predominate in US shootings.

> Regardless of guns and gun laws, knives are still used to kill more people than guns. Are you planning to ban them too?
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#4
(05-24-2020, 08:50 PM)andrew_o Wrote: > Regardless of guns and gun laws, knives are still used to kill more people than guns. Are you planning to ban them too?

And don't forget about hammers and fists/feet - https://khqa.com/news/local/new-report-m...10-17-2019.
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#5
(05-25-2020, 11:29 AM)brunt Wrote:
(05-24-2020, 08:50 PM)andrew_o Wrote: > Regardless of guns and gun laws, knives are still used to kill more people than guns. Are you planning to ban them too?

And don't forget about hammers and fists/feet - https://khqa.com/news/local/new-report-m...10-17-2019.


invention of pistols was always called the great equalizer,

now women and any man, could defend themselves from big bad bullies.





Now, in some places, with guns confiscated, History has gone backwards and now "big bad bullies" have the upper hand again - rule by "fists and feet and hammers" instead of reason.

and to hell with free equal people's right to self defense
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#6
(05-25-2020, 01:10 PM)DaveGillie Wrote:
(05-25-2020, 11:29 AM)brunt Wrote:
(05-24-2020, 08:50 PM)andrew_o Wrote: > Regardless of guns and gun laws, knives are still used to kill more people than guns. Are you planning to ban them too?

And don't forget about hammers and fists/feet - https://khqa.com/news/local/new-report-m...10-17-2019.


invention of pistols was always called the great equalizer,

now women and any man, could defend themselves from big bad bullies.





Now, in some places, with guns confiscated, History has gone backwards and now "big bad bullies" have the upper hand again - rule by "fists and feet and hammers" instead of reason.

and to hell with free equal people's right to self defense

And even in Canada, where firearms are somewhat restricted (not that difficult to get shotguns and non-scary looking rifles, no automatic rifles, and pistols are difficult to get), and where there is a theoretical right to self defense (although that is quite arguable), where they really get you is with storage laws. In fact, if you are able to get to your weapons in time to defend yourself from home invaders, that is basically proof that they were incorrectly stored, and you will be charged with that in addition to a possible murder charge.

My brother is good friends with a retired cop. Cop friend suggested a scenario where you store your weapons with cleaning kits in them. If one were to ever find oneself in a situation to need the weapon, one could use it, set out the cleaning equipment, and tell the attending cops that it was a good thing that you couldn't sleep and decided to clean your weapons.
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#7
This is one gripe I have with the USA: in general gun owners are far too lax regarding storage. It should be in the safe or under your personal control. Not left in a glove box or a sock drawer waiting for the next burglar.

I'm OK with the right to bear arms but I also think it wouldn't hurt if people did some training first, as we do here.
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#8
(05-25-2020, 08:18 PM)andrew_o Wrote: This is one gripe I have with the USA: in general gun owners are far too lax regarding storage. It should be in the safe or under  your personal control. Not left in a glove box or a sock drawer waiting for the next burglar.

I'm OK with the right to bear arms but I also think it wouldn't hurt if people did some training first, as we do here.

Absolutely - having a right to bear arms does not necessarily mean that it is automatic. I am personally fine with having to take some basic safety courses. By 18 years old, I had more training than most cops have in a career.
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#9
That's my experience on the range - the cops were generally the least competent. In NZ a national range inspector booted the cops off a few shooting ranges through misbehaviour
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