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College as a Cargo Cult
#1
Quote:The term "Cargo Cult" comes from WWII, when US & Japanese troops setup bases on primitive islands like Papua New Guinea & Vanuatu.

After the war was over, US & Japan packed up their bases and left. And the primitive island natives really started to miss the canned food, manufactured clothing, etc.

So the primitive island natives started building wooden airplanes, waving sticks on runways, wearing coconuts on their ears, in an attempt to mimic the behavior & appearance of the US & Japanese forces, and hopefully "summon" airplanes out of the air, that would be full of canned food, manufactured clothing, etc.

Of course, no cargo airplanes showed up.

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cargo_cult

This "cargo cult" behavior occurred on different pacfic islands that had no communication with each other, which suggests that the "cargo cult" mentality is possibly innate in humans.

In modern economics, the term "Cargo Cult" is often used to describe when people try to mimic superficial behavior & appearance, in an attempt to achieve a result, without really understanding the underlying mechanics.

For example: The modern student loan bubble can be seen as a cargo cult. In the 1950s, it was observed that people with college degrees were richer, smarter, and had better lives. So true to "Cargo Cult" mentality, USA has lowered academic standards, backed unlimited student loans, spent lots of money on sports stadiums, parties, luxury dorms & water parks for dumb people, and printed up tons of worthless degrees, hoping that those pieces of paper would make everyone great. The net result has been inflated tuition, tons of student loan debt, and people with worthless degrees now flipping burgers. Reality is that college grads in the 1950s had better lives, because those were the smartest people. Lowering academic standards, and handing worthless pieces of paper to retards won't make them into brilliant engineers & scientists.
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#2
Quote:So true to "Cargo Cult" mentality, USA has lowered academic standards, backed unlimited student loans, spent lots of money on sports stadiums, parties, luxury dorms & water parks for dumb people, and printed up tons of worthless degrees, hoping that those pieces of paper would make everyone great. The net result has been inflated tuition, tons of student loan debt, and people with worthless degrees now flipping burgers. Reality is that college grads in the 1950s had better lives, because those were the smartest people. Lowering academic standards, and handing worthless pieces of paper to retards won't make them into brilliant engineers & scientists.


RE Quoted for truth

said a different way by Stefen Molyneux

[video=dailymotion]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O6gi4zZsdHA[/video]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O6gi4zZsdHA
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#3
Compared to sixty years ago, most American Restaurants today are debased, unfulfilling, watered-down, devoid of any worthy nutritional purpose, overpriced, take up too much time, opened to the unwashed masses who don't belong there, who can't benefit from being there, and way too many people need a large loan to go to one.

Real Americans need to get a real basic cast-iron skillet as soon as they graduate from high school and totally avoid the filthy American Restaurant car-go cult.

If America were ever to be moral again, more people need to stay home and cook for themselves again, and completely avoid the mind-twisting, soul-deforming and gut-corrupting American restaurant culture.

oly
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#4
(10-01-2016, 10:20 PM)ModestProposals Wrote:
Quote:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cargo_cult

This "cargo cult" behavior occurred on different pacfic islands that had no communication with each other, which suggests that the "cargo cult" mentality is possibly innate in humans.

In modern economics, the term "Cargo Cult" is often used to describe when people try to mimic superficial behavior & appearance, in an attempt to achieve a result, without really understanding the underlying mechanics.

For example: The modern student loan bubble can be seen as a cargo cult. In the 1950s, it was observed that people with college degrees were richer, smarter, and had better lives. So true to "Cargo Cult" mentality, USA has lowered academic standards, backed unlimited student loans, spent lots of money on sports stadiums, parties, luxury dorms & water parks for dumb people, and printed up tons of worthless degrees, hoping that those pieces of paper would make everyone great. The net result has been inflated tuition, tons of student loan debt, and people with worthless degrees now flipping burgers. Reality is that college grads in the 1950s had better lives, because those were the smartest people. Lowering academic standards, and handing worthless pieces of paper to retards won't make them into brilliant engineers & scientists.


An excellent analysis and conclusion.

When I was a kid (way back in the Dark Ages) the school authorities used to suss out those who were academically inclined and were
comfortable and proficient in handling abstract intellectual ideas, and those who weren't.  Those were the folks more capable of dealing
with concrete things, that is, things that they could physically hold and manipulate, and thereby be able to wrap their minds around.

For about half of the day, all students were in the same building covering the basics of Language, Math, and things like Civics.

The rest of the day saw the academically inclined students go deeper into History, Literature, and Trig & Calculus.

The VocEd (vocational education) students went to a variety of other places, where they learned the basics of plumbing, or auto
repair, or electrical work, or office skills like typing and bookkeeping.

And almost everybody ended up much happier.

Very much akin to the old German/Prussian system, as TUS has related on another thread.

There was absolutely nothing wrong with that perspective, and more likely led to success in life for more people.

The last time I was in France I met a fellow American traveler from Baltimore who had done just that.

He started a drain-clean-out and septic pumping company right out of High School.  Worked at it, year in and
year out, building it up, expanding his market, hiring employees, until, in his mid-fifties, he sold the entire
business to RotoRooter for several million dollars.

The Millionaire Next Door is the first of a series of like-named books about this very thing.
"Sooner or later everyone sits down to a banquet of consequences."  -- RLStevenson
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#5
Quote:oly2059Compared to sixty years ago, most American Restaurants today are debased, unfulfilling, watered-down, devoid of any worthy nutritional purpose, overpriced, take up too much time, opened to the unwashed masses who don't belong there, who can't benefit from being there, and way too many people need a large loan to go to one.

Compared to 60 years ago, most is true, but so is much other parts of the economy.

NOT the TIME thing though, modern US Restaurants are DRAMATICALLLY FASTER!!


AND it is a Free Market you know, if yhou think (or anyone thinks) they can do better, HAVE AT IT!!! duh

Quote:Real Americans need to get a real basic cast-iron skillet as soon as they graduate from high school and totally avoid the filthy American Restaurant car-go cult.

omg, yea right, like we HAVE that much extra time!!!!!!!!
or would do it when we do! sheessshhhh.


Quote:If America were ever to be moral again, more people need to stay home and cook for themselves again, and completely avoid the mind-twisting, soul-deforming and gut-corrupting American restaurant culture.

what does "moral" have to do with this??
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#6
The point is that you can take any passably-written rant against any American institution (perhaps the rant should not have too many precise numbers), then drop the words "restaurant" and/or "restauranteur" into that rant (replacing the original subject matter), and it will sound just as reasonable as what has been written about higher education so far in this thread.

But non-sarcastically, the vast majority of restaurants contribute to poor nutrition, indigestion, obesity, high blood pressure, high blood sugar and are very overpriced for what you receive for your money.  Collectively, the American people spent more bad money on shit restaurants than they do on pissy higher education.

All of that said, might I suggest that America has so many pissy colleges and universities to divert the riff-raff and keep them away from the seventy-five or one hundred schools that actually count for something???

oly
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#7
(10-02-2016, 06:35 PM)oly2059 Wrote: The point is that you can take any passably-written rant against any American institution (perhaps the rant should not have too many precise numbers), then drop the words "restaurant" and/or "restauranteur" into that rant (replacing the original subject matter), and it will sound just as reasonable as what has been written about higher education so far in this thread.

But non-sarcastically, the vast majority of restaurants contribute to poor nutrition, indigestion, obesity, high blood pressure, high blood sugar and are very overpriced for what you receive for your money.  Collectively, the American people spent more bad money on shit restaurants than they do on pissy higher education.

All of that said, might I suggest that America has so many pissy colleges and universities to divert the riff-raff and keep them away from the seventy-five or one hundred schools that actually count for something???

oly

I was wondering that, but wanted to address your points because I wasn't sure. Good illustrating point though.

I believe the one on Colleges so it seems to make sense and work with me, I'd imagine most people are influenced this way!

I agree on the nutrition point too, just that, believe it or not, restaurants are irrelevant to that point because we can only sell what customers will be and we can get provided to us. I'm a foreigner working here and talking of the difference in restaurant food is VERY interesting.



back to Colleges, they do have a MYTH that the diploma means education - sorta like the ones given out by the WIZARD OF OZ (love that movie).
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#8
I graduated from a Big 10 university in 1981, and I am quite certain that our overall education back then was much less rigorous than what was standard at the same school in 1961.  A lot depends on what extra stuff you go out and get yourself - all the books, tools and teachers are there, but you yourself gotta want to learn.

As for people who think they are educated because they have a degree...

For a number of years, I worked with a fellow who had attended the Junior Community College of the Upper Peninsula, located in Marquette, MI.  He had a very dubious associates degree (of which he was very proud) and somehow he managed to be hired in our Agency some ten years before me.

This fellow loved to tell the bankers that he had graduated from "Marquette" (and I truly doubt that my co-worker had ever heard of Marquette University).  The bankers would take in this comment, and invariably before the bank examination was completed they would corner me and ask "How did this guy ever graduate from a major Catholic/ Jesuit university???".

This guy finally got ran out of the Agency by a bitch supervisor who harassed the shit out of him, and he probably fell from a sixty thousand dollar a year job to something that brought about one-third that.

He never recovered, I'm certain.

oly
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#9
(10-02-2016, 08:33 PM)oly2059 Wrote: I graduated from a Big 10 university in 1981, and I am quite certain that our overall education back then was much less rigorous than what was standard at the same school in 1961.  A lot depends on what extra stuff you go out and get yourself - all the books, tools and teachers are there, but you yourself gotta want to learn.

As for people who think they are educated because they have a degree...

For a number of years, I worked with a fellow who had attended the Junior Community College of the Upper Peninsula, located in Marquette, MI.  He had a very dubious associates degree (of which he was very proud) and somehow he managed to be hired in our Agency some ten years before me.

This fellow loved to tell the bankers that he had graduated from "Marquette" (and I truly doubt that my co-worker had ever heard of Marquette University).  The bankers would take in this comment, and invariably before the bank examination was completed they would corner me and ask "How did this guy ever graduate from a major Catholic/ Jesuit university???".

This guy finally got ran out of the Agency by a bitch supervisor who harassed the shit out of him, and he probably fell from a sixty thousand dollar a year job to something that brought about one-third that.

He never recovered, I'm certain.

oly

Oly, I see what you did there in your earlier post...nicely played. 

I agree with your sentiments. A college degree does not mean that one is "properly" educated. It should also not be a measure of intelligence. So many factors to consider. However, if I were to point to one significant shift, it was when a college degree became a gatekeeper to getting a better job. At that point, the conversation shifted from being a means for personal improvement towards simply being an indicator of marketability; from being a well-rounded, cultured, man of letters to just calculating the ROI on your degree and looking at starting salaries for various majors. And thus, students tend to avoid the humanities, arts, and most sciences and instead focus on the payoff degrees like business , health care, and  engineering, which are fields of study focused  on  workforce preparation rather than teaching one how to think/reason. 

On college campuses you can spot the people that have a bona fide love of learning from those that see it as a hurdle on their way to whatever. I personally loved university. I ended up with a double major and an almost Ph.D (opted out with a masters). Even now I enjoy taking courses online and reading as much as I can. My profession is one that forces me to constantly be up to date, which is one of the things I enjoy about it. 

That is not to say that there is anything wrong with wanting to get a better job and being marketable. But the expense of a degree has distorted one of the the fundamental reasons one should be seeking an education - to learn about the world and how to reason in it. 

There are a lot of really brilliant students at universities and many more dumb asses. But the original poster seemed to suggest that a degree was worthless and people are just lemmings by getting one. That is certainly not true if that was the intent. I think the real point is that one cannot assume that a degree holder is either intelligent or educated and you have to dig a little deeper to find out which.

Quick question, which big10 university did you attend?
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#10
Long ago and (not so) far away, I got a bachelors degree from the University of Illinois at Champaign-Urbana.  The school and the diploma served me rather well through the subsequent years, although I have something of a low key love-hate relationship with the place today.

I would ask you what was your Alma Mater???

Truly educated people are generalists by nature, and the schools today are largely turning out technicians - people who know a lot about one specific/ narrow field.  That is actually what our society wants - it wants people who can be dropped into a specific institutional situation anywhere in this nation and immediately function in their trained role.  If these people function well enough, then they will get a decent share of the cargo.

I hate to admit it, but I have a daughter in college today, and my wife and I are definitely pushing her into a specialty field - she is likely to be a pretty strict technician.  She is not getting much exposure to anything like liberal arts and sciences at school.  But, she seems happy enough with her courses/training, and perhaps she can pick up some bits of generalist knowledge as she gets older.

The rants against college itself (the academic part) seem largely misguided even if the courses are debased compared to what was taught in the past.  The introduction to subject matter and new ideas is  better than no introduction.

I will also tell people who aren't presently close to the college bit - these kids rack up huge debts today partly because they live so high when they are in college!!!  After their freshman year, kids don't want to live in a dormitory and eat at the cafeteria!!!  They rack up unnecessary additional debt for a private apartment, every meal at a restaurant or fast food joint, and yes, they gotta have a car on campus too!!!  The college administration and the business people in the college towns won't tell these kids they are living too high too early in life!!! Those are the extras that send student loan debts so high.

oly

P.S. There is one simple question which is a good gauge of whether or not a person is likely to be educated:  "How many books do you own?".
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